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	<title>Comments on: iPhone SDK background processes: are Apple lazy, greedy or stubborn?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php</link>
	<description>tracking the iPhone revolution</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 15 Nov 2011 14:31:06 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Ellena Carwin</title>
		<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/comment-page-1#comment-66596</link>
		<dc:creator>Ellena Carwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Apr 2011 00:31:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php#comment-66596</guid>
		<description>Excellent post. I was checking constantly this blog and I am impressed! Very helpful info particularly the last part :) I care for such information much. I was seeking this certain info for a long time. Thank you and best of luck.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent post. I was checking constantly this blog and I am impressed! Very helpful info particularly the last part :) I care for such information much. I was seeking this certain info for a long time. Thank you and best of luck.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Kenya Sirna</title>
		<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/comment-page-1#comment-66567</link>
		<dc:creator>Kenya Sirna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Apr 2011 11:41:41 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>This web is great make money shortening your links!! http://adf.ly/X8Wd</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This web is great make money shortening your links!! <a href="http://adf.ly/X8Wd" rel="nofollow">http://adf.ly/X8Wd</a></p>
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		<title>By: Chris Davies</title>
		<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/comment-page-1#comment-22129</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Davies</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 21:37:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php#comment-22129</guid>
		<description>Thing is, Arn, how do I know whether I&#039;ve got IMs waiting for me if AOL&#039;s app has to close and can&#039;t alert me to them?  Gathering missed messages is only half of the problem, it&#039;s doing something meaningful with them that&#039;s the bigger issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thing is, Arn, how do I know whether I&#8217;ve got IMs waiting for me if AOL&#8217;s app has to close and can&#8217;t alert me to them?  Gathering missed messages is only half of the problem, it&#8217;s doing something meaningful with them that&#8217;s the bigger issue.</p>
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		<title>By: Arn</title>
		<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/comment-page-1#comment-22126</link>
		<dc:creator>Arn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 20:06:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php#comment-22126</guid>
		<description>Peter has a fantastic point.

Most of the issues/complaints people have raised about a lack of background tasks involve monitoring or collecting data from the internet while &quot;minimized&quot; in the background. Isn&#039;t that a task better served by a server? (where, once launched, the app quickly checks in with a server to update itself on what it missed while the app was shut down).

The chat example is perfect. Why can&#039;t AOL&#039;s servers grab the messages I missed while I was using another app, and fill me in as soon as I get back to AOL&#039;s app?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peter has a fantastic point.</p>
<p>Most of the issues/complaints people have raised about a lack of background tasks involve monitoring or collecting data from the internet while &#8220;minimized&#8221; in the background. Isn&#8217;t that a task better served by a server? (where, once launched, the app quickly checks in with a server to update itself on what it missed while the app was shut down).</p>
<p>The chat example is perfect. Why can&#8217;t AOL&#8217;s servers grab the messages I missed while I was using another app, and fill me in as soon as I get back to AOL&#8217;s app?</p>
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		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/comment-page-1#comment-22122</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 18:10:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php#comment-22122</guid>
		<description>The problem is that, sometimes, there&#039;s not a good solution for the problem.

Consider a chat program, as a fun example.  You connect to the chat server and as long as you stay connected, you are considered &quot;on line&quot; and able to send and receive messages.  As soon as you disconnect, you are no longer &quot;on line&quot; and people cannot send messages to you.  If your computer crashes or your network goes out or whatever, the network says you disconnected.  Thus, the developer doesn&#039;t have to write code to determine whether you are &quot;connected&quot;--the network does it for you.

Perfectly reasonable design decision, right?

The problem is that in order for a wireless device to do this, it has to stay &quot;connected&quot;, which means it&#039;s radios have to stay on.  So when you connect to the chat server, it&#039;s the equivalent of making a phone call.  While there may not be any data going over the line, the radio cannot turn off because then the other end would receive a &quot;disconnect&quot; signal over the network and you would no longer be &quot;on line.&quot;

No amount of creative iPhone process scheduling on Apple&#039;s part is going to solve this dilemma.  If your protocol demands that you must be connected in order to receive messages, those radios have to stay on.  If those radios stay on, you&#039;re going to have to eat the power.  Which means your battery life will stink.

So I understand Apple&#039;s desire here.  First, Apple is &quot;sponsoring&quot; (for lack of a better term) the iPhone App Store.  Joe Customer goes to the iPhone App Store and buys cool chat software for $29.99.  He installs it on his phone, fires it up, connects, and is able to receive messages from all his buddies.  Four hours later, his battery is dead.  Who&#039;s he going to blame?  The guy who sold him the software?  That was Apple.  The guy who made the phone?  That was Apple.  Himself?  Please...this is America: We don&#039;t take responsibility here!  ;^)

&quot;Why did Apple sell me such crappy software!  I want my money back!&quot; he&#039;ll complain--and rightly so.  So now we need uninstallers--to get the software off the phone.  We need some way to do refunds.  And Apple needs some way to recreate a happy customer again...

So I understand where Apple is coming from.  That said, the &quot;no daemons&quot; rule is a pretty inflexible way of solving the problem.  There may be protocols that don&#039;t have the problems of the chat protocol I described.  There are ways of working around the problems of the chat protocol I mentioned.  And since Apple is the ultimate distributor of applications, the control could be put there with some guidelines to developers for how much of the battery they&#039;re allowed to use.

I&#039;m definitely interested in seeing how this works out--especially since I have a &quot;killer app&quot; I would love to write but it will require a daemon to be effective...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem is that, sometimes, there&#8217;s not a good solution for the problem.</p>
<p>Consider a chat program, as a fun example.  You connect to the chat server and as long as you stay connected, you are considered &#8220;on line&#8221; and able to send and receive messages.  As soon as you disconnect, you are no longer &#8220;on line&#8221; and people cannot send messages to you.  If your computer crashes or your network goes out or whatever, the network says you disconnected.  Thus, the developer doesn&#8217;t have to write code to determine whether you are &#8220;connected&#8221;&#8211;the network does it for you.</p>
<p>Perfectly reasonable design decision, right?</p>
<p>The problem is that in order for a wireless device to do this, it has to stay &#8220;connected&#8221;, which means it&#8217;s radios have to stay on.  So when you connect to the chat server, it&#8217;s the equivalent of making a phone call.  While there may not be any data going over the line, the radio cannot turn off because then the other end would receive a &#8220;disconnect&#8221; signal over the network and you would no longer be &#8220;on line.&#8221;</p>
<p>No amount of creative iPhone process scheduling on Apple&#8217;s part is going to solve this dilemma.  If your protocol demands that you must be connected in order to receive messages, those radios have to stay on.  If those radios stay on, you&#8217;re going to have to eat the power.  Which means your battery life will stink.</p>
<p>So I understand Apple&#8217;s desire here.  First, Apple is &#8220;sponsoring&#8221; (for lack of a better term) the iPhone App Store.  Joe Customer goes to the iPhone App Store and buys cool chat software for $29.99.  He installs it on his phone, fires it up, connects, and is able to receive messages from all his buddies.  Four hours later, his battery is dead.  Who&#8217;s he going to blame?  The guy who sold him the software?  That was Apple.  The guy who made the phone?  That was Apple.  Himself?  Please&#8230;this is America: We don&#8217;t take responsibility here!  ;^)</p>
<p>&#8220;Why did Apple sell me such crappy software!  I want my money back!&#8221; he&#8217;ll complain&#8211;and rightly so.  So now we need uninstallers&#8211;to get the software off the phone.  We need some way to do refunds.  And Apple needs some way to recreate a happy customer again&#8230;</p>
<p>So I understand where Apple is coming from.  That said, the &#8220;no daemons&#8221; rule is a pretty inflexible way of solving the problem.  There may be protocols that don&#8217;t have the problems of the chat protocol I described.  There are ways of working around the problems of the chat protocol I mentioned.  And since Apple is the ultimate distributor of applications, the control could be put there with some guidelines to developers for how much of the battery they&#8217;re allowed to use.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m definitely interested in seeing how this works out&#8211;especially since I have a &#8220;killer app&#8221; I would love to write but it will require a daemon to be effective&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: AdamC</title>
		<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/comment-page-1#comment-22118</link>
		<dc:creator>AdamC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 17:15:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php#comment-22118</guid>
		<description>A suggestion for Goodwin, try to join Apple and get into their iPhone development team. Or write an app for Apple to use so that third party apps can be run in the background without consuming the power of the battery and processor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A suggestion for Goodwin, try to join Apple and get into their iPhone development team. Or write an app for Apple to use so that third party apps can be run in the background without consuming the power of the battery and processor.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: cuteangel</title>
		<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/comment-page-1#comment-22117</link>
		<dc:creator>cuteangel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 16:32:38 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>apple iphone is really amazing product</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>apple iphone is really amazing product</p>
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		<title>By: Alain</title>
		<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/comment-page-1#comment-22112</link>
		<dc:creator>Alain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 14:19:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php#comment-22112</guid>
		<description>Its amazing how many people can actually sit there and trow rocks at the Apple .
its really easy to wait for something to come out and find things that are wrong with it but when it comes down to reality all those morrons that write stuff on new products and technology never actually invented anything I thinks it takes balls to compete in the tech world and I totally respect what Apple is trying to acheive ,sure there is going to be a couple of duds along the way but overall they are still way ahead of the game .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its amazing how many people can actually sit there and trow rocks at the Apple .<br />
its really easy to wait for something to come out and find things that are wrong with it but when it comes down to reality all those morrons that write stuff on new products and technology never actually invented anything I thinks it takes balls to compete in the tech world and I totally respect what Apple is trying to acheive ,sure there is going to be a couple of duds along the way but overall they are still way ahead of the game .</p>
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		<title>By: Azazello</title>
		<link>http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php/comment-page-1#comment-22110</link>
		<dc:creator>Azazello</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 14:10:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.iphonebuzz.com/iphone-sdk-background-processes-are-apple-lazy-greedy-or-stubborn-282101.php#comment-22110</guid>
		<description>(....)   (....)

a sleeper post... but to quote ZDNet?

http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2008/03/13/iphone-20-sdk-the-no-multitasking-myth/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(&#8230;.)   (&#8230;.)</p>
<p>a sleeper post&#8230; but to quote ZDNet?</p>
<p><a href="http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2008/03/13/iphone-20-sdk-the-no-multitasking-myth/" rel="nofollow">http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2008/03/13/iphone-20-sdk-the-no-multitasking-myth/</a></p>
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